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CKeen
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 Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 18:35 Post subject: |
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| VikingBoyBilly wrote: | | I think Doom 3 could have been good, with the engine and features it had, if the maps were just designed in a way that wasn't so linear. I understand they had to put visportals in the doors to only render a room in a map when the player sees it, but I don't think that was a huge obstacle in making multiple pathways that was at least longer than one small hallway or just a door to an office room where the PDA (as in the key to the next area) is just a few feet away from the place you need to use it, and the thing that consumes your time in getting it is the demons spawning in the area. |
They made it like that because that's how Half Life was. Carmack followed the trend, simple as that.
This is exactly why Half Life is a really terrible game.
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| Paramultart wrote: | | Scarlet wrote: |
Ckeen, that is just your opinion. |
You can't tell CKeen that. He is always right. |
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wiivn
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 18:58 Post subject: |
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| CKeen wrote: |
They made it like that because that's how Half Life was. Carmack followed the trend, simple as that.
This is exactly why Half Life is a really terrible game. |
wow wow wow!11111 You've got it all wrong here! Trend? WTF? garg men! On what drugs are you? Doom 3 has NOTHING in common with Half-Life! And I'll just pretend I didn't read your statement about Half-Life because you really pissed me off!! |
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Djaser
Holy Monk Yorp
Joined: 31 Oct 2007
Posts: 473
Location: political refugee
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 20:16 Post subject: |
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| wiivn wrote: | | CKeen wrote: |
They made it like that because that's how Half Life was. Carmack followed the trend, simple as that.
This is exactly why Half Life is a really terrible game. |
wow wow wow!11111 You've got it all wrong here! Trend? WTF? garg men! On what drugs are you? Doom 3 has NOTHING in common with Half-Life! And I'll just pretend I didn't read your statement about Half-Life because you really pissed me off!! |
Despite Half-life being the best game ever, it's still only a game. Calm down!
I must say that the opening of Doom III reminded me a lot of Half life; the story and pacing are basically the same.
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CKeen
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| Posted: Tue Aug 23, 2011 22:45 Post subject: |
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| wiivn wrote: | | CKeen wrote: |
They made it like that because that's how Half Life was. Carmack followed the trend, simple as that.
This is exactly why Half Life is a really terrible game. |
wow wow wow!11111 You've got it all wrong here! Trend? WTF? garg men! On what drugs are you? Doom 3 has NOTHING in common with Half-Life! And I'll just pretend I didn't read your statement about Half-Life because you really pissed me off!! |
I'm sorry if having a different opinion than you on a videogame is enough to make you go all butthurt. Half Life is a terrible game and that's just my opinion - whether you enjoy it or not, I don't really care.
But the fact Doom 3 is a sad rip-off of Half Life is not my opinion - it is a matter of fact. If you can't recognize that then I guess you haven't played the two games at all. I have, and the boring, slow-paced, absolutely linear and tedious gameplay of half life is absolutely worthless compared to the action-packed fun of games like duke nukem 3d.
That said, let's not start a flamewar over some videogames. Seriously.
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| Paramultart wrote: | | Scarlet wrote: |
Ckeen, that is just your opinion. |
You can't tell CKeen that. He is always right. |
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VikingBoyBilly
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Joined: 05 Jan 2008
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 1:51 Post subject: |
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I don't even remember half-life being linear, but all the useless talking NPCs and the health vending machines on the walls were definately ripped off from half-life (and half-life ripped off the health thing from marathon to begin with, but no matter).
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wiivn
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 4:09 Post subject: |
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duh! And doom 3 ripped the first person view from half-life...
You know I can argue with you, but if you don't care about my opinion it will get messy and ceilick will delete my post. Anyway, I'll express my opinion on Rage when it's out. I can only imagine what garg you will say about it. |
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CKeen
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| Posted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:11 Post subject: |
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| wiivn wrote: | | duh! And doom 3 ripped the first person view from half-life... |
I'm not sure if you're just pretending you aren't getting it or if you really haven't played the games.
Okay let me try to explain. Play this wad:
http://www.doomworld.com/idgames/?id=16551
Then play Half Life.
Then play Doom 3 and tell me if it feels like that wad or if it feels just like Half Life (techbase corridors everywhere, the same premise about you starting in a base and then the base becoming overrun by aliens/demons/whatever). The same boring and uninteresting gameplay that DOES NOT feel like the one present in the wad I linked AT ALL because that wad has incredibly fast paced gameplay with big outdoor areas that guarantee easy maneuvers. There's lot of action, cleverness and strategy which is replaced altogether by boring, slow-paced gameplay in Half Life and in its clone, Doom 3.
| wiivn wrote: | | You know I can argue with you, but if you don't care about my opinion it will get messy and ceilick will delete my post. Anyway, I'll express my opinion on Rage when it's out. I can only imagine what garg you will say about it. |
I didn't mean I don't care about your opinion, what I meant is that I don't care if I piss you off because I have a different opinion. Regarding Rage, it looks promising. I'll comment on it when it's out.
| VikingBoyBilly wrote: | | I don't even remember half-life being linear, but all the useless talking NPCs and the health vending machines on the walls were definately ripped off from half-life (and half-life ripped off the health thing from marathon to begin with, but no matter). |
Ahh man the talking NPCs... Half Life was praised for having people you can talk to but I swear, those were the most USELESS NPCs in a videogame, EVER! All the guards would say is "I'm busy get the fucl out" and the scientists "hello Gordon". Sure, you can get some of them to help you by activating some machinery or something but it's still not nearly as good as the NPCs used by Strife 2 years prior to HL's release.
ANYWAY: this is a topic regarding RAGE so let's get back on that.
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| Paramultart wrote: | | Scarlet wrote: |
Ckeen, that is just your opinion. |
You can't tell CKeen that. He is always right. |
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Lava89
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| Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 15:00 Post subject: |
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Following your logic, CKeen, Half-Life was inspired by Doom, so doesn't that make Doom a terrible game? 
As for Rage, I'm just glad ID is doing something other than a Doom \ Quake rehash or sequel. |
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Galaxieretter
Arachnut
Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 892
Location: Lancaster PA
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| Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 15:51 Post subject: |
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| VikingBoyBilly wrote: | | Maybe he's a changed man, and is actually a human being and not at all like I demonize him out to be |
| VikingBoyBilly wrote: | | demonize |
| VikingBoyBilly wrote: | | John Carmack |
| VikingBoyBilly wrote: | | First off, Carmack said that looking back at how Doom 3 was, he would have done differently if he had the chance to make Doom 3 again. And from what it looks like, Doom 4 is going to be more similar to the first two games. |
Yeah I bet he wouldn't have made Doom the movie.
id Software should sue for defamation or something, especially with lewd lines which had no relation to the Doom game, books, series or franchise in any way and reflected poorly upon what id Software is and the work they produce.
I'm sure there was something they can bring up in court to get that movie thrown out and at least get some reimbursement toward an actual DOOM-
MOVIE.
That would be like independently filmed by a team that id Software hires,
and not Hollywood.
That's why I hate Hollywood.
It's so fucl ing fake.
| CKeen wrote: | | Doom 3 is pretty much a reskinned Half life with demons |
Half Life was a reskinned Quake 2.
| CKeen wrote: | | (that barely look like demons anyway). |
You walk into a room, there is a still living man impaled upon the ceiling. His flesh is being desecrated by dark energy.
An enemy called "maggots" which have two heads and have the distorted form of a bipedal humanoid, start crawling out of air vents, holes in the ceiling and the walls to attack you while electro magnetic interference shuts down computers and machinery in the room.
Definitely not demons.
| CKeen wrote: | | And change means the evolutionary line that exists between Doom, Duke Nukem 3D and Painkiller. |
Doom, 1993, Duke Numem 3D, 1996.
Painkiller, 2004.
8 years later.
Unreal
Serious Engine
ID Tech 3? Quake 3.
A few others.
Painkiller was way behind in its technology in 2004.
You might as well say,
Doom, Duke Nukem 3D, Doom 3, because painkiller and Doom 3 were released in the same year.
Far Cry, Serious Sam 2 and Half Life 2 were the same year as well.
All had way better engine technology than Painkiller.
| CKeen wrote: | | And lately, Raven Software is basically making the games for ID: Quake 4, Wolfenstein... All were made with the assistance of Raven. |
That's because they were hired to do so. It's an id Software game.
| CKeen wrote: | They made it like that because that's how Half Life was. Carmack followed the trend, simple as that.
This is exactly why Half Life is a really terrible game. |
I don't think you understand what it was like before these games came out. You probably played Half Life after or right before Half Life 2 was made.
For someone that played Doom and Doom 2, then later played Doom 3.
When Half Life was made, there wasn't really anything like it in terms of performance for a FPS. Also mods like Counter Strike made it really big,
because you know Counter Strike was a 300 something MB download
and while some people had high speed internet, most had 56 K,
and back then, as well, many servers wouldn't upload at the speed you could download if you had good high speed.
Things were different back then.
| CKeen wrote: | | That said, let's not start a flamewar over some videogames. Seriously. |
Then stop trying to light one.
| Paramultart wrote: | To say the rest of the team was expendable, that it's okay to screw over the very people who helped found your company, and to deny that ID's games got progressively worse as the team gradually broke apart, is unspeakably backwards and wrong.
Now all we get is tech, with the mentality that artists and designers are expendable, or a dime a dozen. |
Name 3 people from the credits of Doom 3 or Quake 3, which weren't people who worked on Doom 1.
| Paramultart wrote: | | He didn't just create textures, he created immersive environments, memorable imagery, TRUE ART in video games. |
If he wanted to do that, I'm sure he has the tenacity at this point to make his own personal game.
Like he would know what he's doing, that is, if he wants to do that with his life.
American McGee did it, and he's still reinventing himself.
You have to appreciate talent where it's due. Tim Schaffer does that too, but I hate that guy's style.
| Paramultart wrote: | | Yeah, he couldn't paint every single texture by himself in RAGE (although look at the work he did in Quake... That's insane), but he should have at least been a creative consultant, or lead designer. |
Or he could have been fired.
Quake? Quake was super low resolution. Quake 2 was better but low resolution. Quake 3 was better but still low resolution, but good 3D models.
Rage?
Crazy artwork.
| RoboBlue wrote: | | To be fair (and balance out GR's depressing statements), there seem to be fewer fun games today than there were in the 90s. Bioshock looked/sounded fantastic, and the plot was really intriguing, but the gameplay bored me in minutes. |
Just as it was in the 90's, you have to separate the good games from the shallow ones. It was easier in the 90's because most of the high-profile computer games were good.
Bioshock was a paranoid idiot game. BioSuck and BioFail 2.
Can't wait for the next one.
You need to know what to play and what you want out of a game.
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VikingBoyBilly
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| Posted: Mon Aug 29, 2011 21:46 Post subject: |
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| Galaxieretter wrote: |
Name 3 people from the credits of Doom 3 or Quake 3, which weren't people who worked on Doom 1. |
Out of the dozens of people who worked on doom 3/quake 3 vs the handful that worked on doom 1? Did you misword that?
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Paramultart
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| Posted: Tue Aug 30, 2011 1:22 Post subject: |
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I am confuse man.
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Galaxieretter
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| Posted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:42 Post subject: |
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Just an FYI for anyone who is interested in purchasing this game,
I pre-ordered this game on Steam yesterday, and then I saw how big the game will actually be.
Rage weighs in at a whopping and ground-breaking twenty-five GIGABYTES. So if you were thinking of getting a DL version from Steam or elsewhere, I have to recommend acquiring a physical copy of the game, and saving your time and bandwidth.
 
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wiivn
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 10:15 Post subject: |
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Apparently, there is some demand for Keen rage over here:
http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/09/14/rps-demands-we-want-keen-dlc-for-rage/ Surprisingly a lot of responses there. But apart from a theoretical plain Dopefish wall poster reference, and as John is the only one left of the original id team, and as their second project is Doom 4, I doubt there would be Keen resurrection. John as always is too obsessed with his engines. However, if these Keen shout-outs are more often addressed directly to him, he might change his mind for a second and start hiring third team for Keen...
Speaking of the Dopefish, there is a Dopefish reference in Deus Ex: HR which I wasn't aware of:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIep_jbP1ME |
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Grimson
The Dragoner
Joined: 14 Jul 2009
Posts: 1639
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:24 Post subject: |
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The laughter just blew my mind. The guy just managed to ruin the entire reference.
| Quote: | | twenty-five GIGABYTES. |
Oh wow. How big are their maps going to be?
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| Snortimer wrote: | | Keen can live forever if he can figure out a way to turn himself into cancer - His grotesque body would grow larger and larger until its pulsating lecherous mass covered the entire universe. |
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jmfmagnum
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Joined: 21 Sep 2011
Posts: 25
Location: somewhere
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| Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 18:29 Post subject: |
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| indeed...first i think : "wtf..!?" until i realize the sound came from the video.... |
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